>> Will give a one minute opening statement followed by questions from the moderator.

The order for answering was chosen by lot with candidates alternating throughout the debate.

Candidate one will respond first.

Candidates will have 60 seconds to respond to each question.

Although the moderator may ask for clarification and specify further response time the debate will end with the final question allowing for closing statements of 30 seconds.

Candidate two will respond first to the final question.

Our timers will make sure we adhere to the agreed times.

The candidates have not seen these questions in advance and have agreed not to bring notes for the questions.

Questions have come primarily from members of the public.

Only those relevant to the duties of office will be asked.

And with that, we will open with our first question.

You have our first question.

What do you see as the top policy challenge of the Secretary of State of Indiana.

>> It necessarily has to be our election integrity the sum total of all the details of getting together to make sure our elections are transparent and accountable and can have restored confidence in our elections.

So we have to look at all of campaign finance law and all of election law to see those opportunities where we can make our elections more secure, more transparent.

>> Thank you.

Ms. Wells what do you see as the top priority for the Secretary of State in Indiana and how do you plan to address it.

>> Thank you for having me tonight.

The Secretary of State's office has multiple roles but this year in 2022 post-202 D 202 post-2020 oh elections the biggest challenge is running it in a clear way.

When the 2020 elections were contested the results were fair and accurate.

It is the Secretary of State's job to make sure that we are educating the population as to our process in fighting this age of disinformation.

As Secretary of State running elections will be our top priority in addition to the other three divisions within the office.

Additionally, Hoosiers are not turning out to vote.

We are 46 in turnout.

We want to make sure that while we are educating about our process we are also engaging the public and ensuring they are turning out to vote and making their voices heard.

>> Thank you.

Ms. Wells, if elected what additional areas of responsibility would you tackle?

>> So I mentioned before that we have poor voter turnout.

The Secretary of State's office has a lot of latitude to engage the public and have civic education and that is one of the priorities I want for the Secretary of State's office.

Additional the Secretary of State's office can show Hoosiers how money outside the elections is influencing their process.

We are last in the nation in our campaign finance transparency and that is because we have statutes that have -- really have no teeth in them and so there's no accountability to the public and we see millions of dollars entering our elections and being resulting in candidates being influenced as to how they are conducting their politics.

And so we want to pull back the curtain on that as Secretary of State and use the tools in the office to educate the public on just where that money is coming from.

>> Thank you.

Mr. Maher, if elected what additional areas of responsibility would you tackle.

>> On election integrity.

And so this is an opportunity.

This election is an opportunity to restore confidence of Hoosiers in our elections process and we can do this with common sense tools.

Like receipts and audits.

We can use receipts for each one of our votes.

And we need a complete and independent audit of all 92 counties before the elections are certified.

Together, these are the tools that will give us the confidence and the transparency to avoid the concerns of 2020.

>> Thank you.

Speaking of 2020, Mr. Maher, was Joe Biden freely elected in that election?

>> Yes.

>> Ms. Wells, the same question.

>> Unequivocally, yes.

>> Thank you.

Ms. Wells, if elected as Secretary of State, how will you fulfill your responsibility that elections are both accessible to those who are eligible to participate and free from fraud and external interference?

>> Well, I would point Hoosiers to the over 50 cases that have transpired since 2020 that showed there was no concerted efforts of fraud on our elections.

That is fighting the disinformation that is out there at the same time though we need to be making sure that we are allowing for accessible elections.

Indiana has some of the most oppressive elections laws in the country, one of the earliest voter registration deadlines that is actually tomorrow so make sure you are registered by tomorrow.

Our polling hours close fairly early.

We have to have excuses to vote by absentee.

Our republican opponent wants to limit them to four.

We are never compromising accessibility we want to ensure.

We can do both.

We can have fair and free elections and also safe and secure.

>> Thank you.

If elected as Secretary of State how would you fulfill the responsibility that elections are accessible but still free from fraud and external interference.

>> I do not favor changing our current exemptions or requirements for photo ID.

And so instead, I would like to focus on receipts and audits these are additional tools that will give us the credibility to know how our elections are performing.

And the audits will show that our 92 county clerks are doing a herculean effort, good work, they are understaffed, underresourced and or worked to evening cute our elections.

They need more training, more resources and more leadership from the Secretary of State's office to ensure that we have an opportunity to restore that trust through common sense solutions, receipts and audits.

>> Ms. Wells, based on your state of priorities, in each of your campaign websites you have some overlap in what you'd like to see done and either of you win the election are there any specific policies that you would want to collaborate on?

>> So I would like to counter that as to -- >> You have an opportunity for 30 seconds to counter.

>> As to a specific policy agenda item that he would like to run 92 county audits.

This is an item by the republican opponent.

We have 92 county clerks that are doing a very good job.

And if there are any, you know, contested races and a candidate just has to ask for a recount.

We already have safeguards and we don't need 92 county audits.

>> Thank you, Ms. Wells.

Mr. Maher I would like to offer you the opportunity to counter for 30 seconds please.

>> We may have safeguards but we have red flashing warning signs that suggests we have problems.

We have clerks entering a secure room.

We have software used in the state of a company whose CEO was just arrested.

We don't know the security we have and the only way to understand what is working and what is not is to get a baseline assessment and that is a complete and independent audit of all 92 counties.

>> Thank you.

Based on your state of priorities of each of your campaigns, you had some overlap in what you'd like to see done.

So looking a little bit differently here, if either of you were to win the election, are there any specific ideas or policies from the other candidate you would like to implement or perhaps either collaborate on I believe I started last with Ms. WELZ so we'll start with you Mr. Maher.

>> We have I think, I believe I shared interest in rank choice voting and a nonpartisan commission for redeistricting.

I asked how I will work with other parties.

And as a third party candidate I can bring all parties together.

Because I am not loyal or beholden to any other party or to any other party chairperson.

So it really is the perfect vantage point from which to make meaningful and substantive improvements in election security.

>> Thank you Mr. Maher.

Ms. WELZ I would like to ask the same question.

>> There are three other divisions, the securities division, the business services division and the automotive dealers services division and so Jeff and I have been on the trail quite a bit and I think we have the same thought process when it comes to making sure that as Secretary of State it is not an elected official who is constantly campaigning but an official who is putting their focus on the office in making sure that it is customer service oriented and serving Hoosiers Ms. Wells I would like to start with you.

You mentioned the other responsibilities of Secretary of State and I want to ask if the Secretary of State's office is budgeted and staffed appropriately to provide all the services that it needs to.

>> So the three hour divisions, the business services division, the securities division and the automotive services division are functioning quite and that is a testament to the secretaries of state but since 2020 we've seen all this final and energy with the elections division.

We see we have an antiquated voting machine structure within Indiana.

We have multiple different standards throughout our 92 counties and what we saw in the previous session was that millions of dollars was budgeted toward what is called a voter verifiable paper audit trail that would be on top of direct reporting -- recording electronic machines.

It is going to take serious conversations with a legislature in making sure we are bringing our machines online and not just sticking to the same systems that we have had previously that are not federal best practices.

>> Thank you Ms. Wells.

>> I would like to ask you the same question if you believe the Secretary of State's office is budgeted and staffed for the services provide.

>> Think about how your life was changed when the new iPhone was introduced.

We need to keep up-to-date with technology and that means investing in new technology and in people who can understand it and manage it safely for us.

While the funding level exists now it needs to constantly evolve with the needs of society and new technology.

One that focuses needs to be on the constant modernization of our elections.

We need to invest in new technologies that allow convenience and security and invest in a comprehensive audit at the end of the day, when we count our votes, the way we count cash, we'll finally get the elections that we deserve.

>> Thank you Mr. Maher, my next question will start with you, what area or division should be a high priority for actions to support Indiana citizens?.

>> For this perspective I would like to take a look at the securities division and this division is involved with investigating securities or financial crimes and so not necessarily stealing somebody's identity or issuing or asking for Target gift cards but more complex financial crimes like selling share to a fraudulent company and this is complex and detailed investigative work and the office works closely with prosecutors and law enforcement but now we have our neighbors who have done everything right.

They have worked hard and are trying to pass on that wealth to children and grandchildren and there are fosters out there who will take care of that that will try to sell them something that is not legitimate.

This needs more resources and more focus to protect our most vulnerable neighbors.

>> Thank you Mr. Maher, Ms. Wells the same question which area of division do you think should be a high priority.

>> I think every decision should be a high priority and I do have to agree with Jeff the securities division is a priority, especially with fraud committed against our older population, collection agencies that need -- that are a little bit too intrusive and also other division like the business services division.

We have so many small business owners and they deserve great customer service and now they have inbusiness.com but it needs to be 2.0.

And so that division too as farce affecting Hoosiers at large it needs more attention and the Secretary of State's office needs to be in the business of governing and not just campaigning as we have seen in the previous year.

>> Thank you.

Ms. Wells, what are your views on ballot access for third parties?.

>> Well, my view is that I am here with Jeff.

And so you know what, we are a third party system but third parties, independent parties also hold us accountable too and so you know, more than anything I try to highlight that in Indiana we are ran right now by a super majority republican legislature, governor and agency and even more than just independent and third parties we need to get back to a two party system and have democrats also involved in the process in keeping our democracy healthy through accountability in a two party system.

>> Thank you, Ms. Wells.

Mr. Maher, the same question.

What are your thoughts on a third party.

>> Wealthy about a restaurant that has only item on the menu and it's something that you hate.

How often would you go to that restaurant in the answer is probably never and so what we need in in Indiana, what will drive voter turnout and is it's going to be options, a bigger menu of options that means more parties and more candidates and more choices for you, the voter.

And the way to achieve that is through more parties and to have more competition when we see this in the environment, when we see two stores competing -- two similar stores competing on street corners you get better quality and lower prices because there's competition and we expect to see that better options on our ballot when we have more third parties who are actively able to participate in the political process.

>> Thank you, Mr. Maher.

I am glad you mentioned voter turnout because that's the subject of my next question.

Indiana regularly ranks among the bottom fifteen in voter turnout.

About half voting and only sometimes up as one in five in local elections does this concern you and how would you address low voter turnout if elected as Secretary of State?

>> Benjamin Franklin wrote to his youngest sister saying if you become a sheep the wolves will eat you and that is what we have right now with low voter turnout.

We have our citizens, our neighbors becoming sheep voluntarily by not engaging to vote.

It's a responsibility and a privilege and a right to vote.

It's critical that you get out and vote because we need your input for our shared future and that means having more options and more composition on your ballot.

We can't sustain the two party system.

If you're exhausted and frustrated with what we have.

If you see things going the wrong way, don't know what the problem is or how to fix it, just look at where we've been.

We've had two party system rule for decades.

If you want a different result, we've got to do something different.

>> Thank you, Mr. Maher.

Ms. Wells, the same question, does low voter turnout bother you?

>> It absolutely bothers me.

When I started as a democratic candidate I was told it was impossible to win because the demographics of Indiana.

Today we are four points up and going throughout the state saying that Indiana is not a red state.

It is a purple state with a voter turnout problem.

In 2020 when the stakes seemed high 1.6 million Hoosiers stayed home.

We are looking at the reasons as to why Hoosiers are not participating and there are multiple reasons to include a couple decades of gerrymandering that make races not competitive and therefore voters are not incentivized to come out.

We need to work toward nonpartisan redistricting to address our voter turnout problem.

>> I don't see a turnout problem I see a trust problem.

And I can't tell you how many of our neighbors I've met who say my vote doesn't count the system is rigged and so what we need to do is bring back trust.

And our opportunity here in this election to restore trust in our elections with common sense solutions, receipts and audits that way the confidence that your vote counts means something.

>> Would you like 30 seconds to respond.

>> Yes, please.

We must be operating from a fact-based evidence-based place.

And so, yes, we do have a voter trust problem but that is because we have been living through the last years of perpetuating a big lie.

When people know longer believe in the truth then the biggest lie wins and we can't further add fuel onto the fire and say your vote doesn't matter or count and we'll have a 92 county audit.

We have to step back and actually start to educate voters on where the truth is.

>> We're going to end it on this topic for a moment but I promise we will return to elections and voting.

I want to know given the responsibilities of Secretary of States in office.

We'll start with you, Ms. Wells.

>> I have sat down with the technology vendor for the Secretary of State's office that helps with the platform in BIZ.com, with COVID what we saw was we started to rely on web-based platforms because of safety measures but now we have an office that largely operates behind this web portal.

What we need to do is we need to bring the technology up-to-date within the Secretary of State's office and it's just not with inbusiness.com.

We can do it with how you can register online while the Secretary of State's office may not make laws like the legislature it is able to shape the Hoosier experience by offering better tools THU technology.

And this is what I would want to do as Secretary of State.

>> Thank you Ms. Wells, Mr. Maher, same question, what would you like to see in business, security, or auto dealer.

>> In the business we have to remember that government exists to serve us and so as an entrepreneur and as a CEO and cofounder of a VR tech company right here in Indiana I've been on that side of the software and so I know what it is to focus on customer satisfaction and cash flows and the last thing I'm concerned about is the stack of paperwork from the government so government needs to serve businesses and the first way to do that is to get out of the way.

To streamline things.

The second thing the office needs to do is to go and live with small businesses live and that means weekend hours and the quiet moments you have to focus on the things that aren't part of your business.

So as part of my platform, I want to expand customer service hours, allow for texting and assign a dedicated account representative to live with the start-ups as they grow so that way there's enhanced customer service.

>> Thank you.

I'd like to ask the candidates how well the business law survey commission serves a proactive role in maintaining a positive Indiana business community.

And Mr. Maher.

>> History tells anytime there's clarity in a marketplace we have people coming in because they know what the risks are and can act on it.

Having the legal infrastructure to guide us is critical.

Think about all of the new and emerging economies and industries that are yet to be developed.

We can build them here.

We have to have clarity around what that's like so autonomous vehicles, medical device, pharmaceuticals, cannabis companies, if and when cannabis is legalized here like it is in our neighboring states.

Think about all the growth opportunities that we have to have clarity around those laws and those industries will help our neighbors build this assistance here.

I am not talking about spending millions of our tax dollars to bring in billion dollar companies overseas.

I'm talking about our neighbors bringing the next big company here in Indiana.

>> Thank you.

How does the business law survey commission serve a proactive role in maintaining a positive Indiana business community.

>> As an attorney, I am also a government litigator.

I have been an attorney for the last decade, to Jeff's point the law is always evolving and changing and it is hard to stay informed as an everyday citizen and so in making sure that we are messaging correctly that we are giving updates and we are allowing for the public to be educated and know how they are maneuvering through the business space it is the responsibility of the Secretary of State's office when working with this commission to further that mission with the public.

>> Thank you.

Ms. Wells, what changes would you make or suggest that the legislature makes in administering elections in the state of Indiana?

>> So when, again, running for this race as a democrat.

I have been asked how does a democratic Secretary of State work with a super majority republican legislature in administering elections.

As a democrat in a two party system I think it is imperative that we are able to work with a republican super majority legislature but also to progress the needs of Hoosiers.

So with accessibility, we need to start advocating for polling hours to go past 6 o'clock.

Indiana closes their polls at 6:00 in the afternoon.

We need to advocate for less restrictive voter laws.

Make sure you register by tomorrow: And so as the Secretary of State we need to be working with the legislature, but also making sure that we are informing the public when the legislate choir choir -- legislature is not accountable.

>> What changes would you suggest or put the legislature to when administering elections in the state.

>> All of our campaign finance law is written by the two old parties.

They wrote this together and it serves to help them stay in office and to keep all others out of office so it's imagine two schoolyard bullies writing all the rules.

That's why we have so little competition on your ballot, so few people running a opposed.

We're going to introduce good accountability, ease of access, transparency, things that make the entire election process more competitive.

We have to take ownership in making elections more competitive for all.

>> Thank you Mr. Maher I will allow a 30 second rebuttal from Ms. Wells.

>> I would like to say as a two party system, this is how our democracy has thrived.

Throughout history.

And that I would like to say that the republican and the democratic party aren't bullies.

The republican party is a party that has had no accountability in the state of Indiana for the last 20 years because of republican super majorities and you get a runaway party.

When we are functioning appropriately we do a good job.

Both parties can have good ideals but it takes the presence of both to keep each other accountable.

Which we don't have in the state of Indiana right now.

>> Our system is not work.

We can see proof because we are missing one of the candidates on the ballot tonight.

So confident we won't care to hear what you have to say.

Our elections are not working because the mirror states like Maryland are just as dysfunctional as Indiana so the duopoly is the problem.

>> Thank you Mr. Maher.

If you're just tuning in we want to welcome you to the debate and I would like to remind you that all three candidates were invited to participate.

IRYou are hearing from two of them this evening.

Republican did not respond to multiple efforts to contact him and his campaign.

And as the debate continues I would like to ask a question specific to voter registration.

Mr. Maher, I will start with you, where do you see the opportunities for improvement with voter registration and what effect do you hope these changes would have?

>> Voter registration comes through -- and being on the campaign it's about engaging with young people so working in high schools and colleges, people who are coming of age to vote, communicating out that parents can take their children with them into the polls, show them the process of how to vote and it comes back to giving them something to vote for not just against.

That's part of the problem.

To give a reason to vote for, we need competition, we need trust in our elections and that's going to come from things like receipts and audits that give us that insight and the clarity to say that my vote counts, I can see it, I can track it just like a package and I know that my voice has been counted.

>> Thank you Mr. Maher, Ms. Wells, specifically to voter registration, what opportunities do you see for improvement and what hope would you like to have?

>> When I see it operating from right now is a place where they are afraid of voters.

Where we are afraid of registering the youth.

And the power of the youth vote.

And so what we need to be doing is operating from a place where we embrace our potential voters where we talk to college students and we talk about their individual voting experience.

Where we don't mire the information where it is confusing and people are unsure if they should be registering or how they should be registering and also from a party perspective we need to be engaging with the public and not just putting out it off on a bunch of nonprofit organizations to do voter registration, it is a group effort from both parties and libertarians and community organizations to get out the vote and to make sure that we are getting individuals registered no matter who they are or where they or who their politics are.

>> Next I would like to ask a question about the most important role of the auto dealership division.

Ms. Wells, we'll start with you, .

>> Working with the auto dealers division, there has a bit of a dynamic between auto dealers and the manufacturers and what the auto dealers are wanting from the Secretary of State is to make sure that there is an equitable process between dealers and the manufacturers.

Also auto dealers are a great example of not being included in the conversation of when statutes are set.

After the fact they find that there are gaps in how we are making the sausage in the legislature and so they want to be represented and they want to have that voice heard and with that, you know, there are other practical standpoints of delivering titles to Hoosiers in time and making sure that the Secretary of State State's office is regulating that process.

But it has been good to get to know the auto dealers throughout Indiana.

>> Mr. Maher, the same question, what do you believe is the most important role is.

>> The Indiana Secretary of State's office is tasked with enforcing state law for the auto dealers industry and much of that is cut and dry but where there's an area for real focus and opportunity is in the gray areas where there are challenging relationships between the franchise dealers and the manufacturers and so when there are new requests coming out such as requiring additional personal data to help dealers manage those relationships perhaps through administrative courts is one solution that reduces costs and accelerates solutions that is one way forward but this is a great example where our private markets recognize the importance of private/personal data and that ties into our election data and making sure that our voter and poll worker data and registration databases are all secure and private.

If it's good for the private market it should be good for our citizens too.

>> Thank you Mr. Maher, why is it necessary for the state to determine operating hours for auto dealerships especially for those voters who may not be familiar with this process?

>> At the end of the day, one bad review on a website or a search report can cost an auto dealer hundreds of thousands of dollars in lost revenues and so they know their businesses, they know their customers, they are highly incentivized to offer outstanding customer service when customers want it.

Here's a matter where governments should step back and work with them to ensure that customers are served fairly and protected but that the dealers are enabled to serve their customers as best they know how.

>> Thank you.

Ms. Wells, the same question, why is it necessary for the at a time to determine operating hours for auto dealerships?

>> Well there's always a balance between having government regulation and then also to Jeff's point fair and free markets.

And so with the hours that have been set, those hours have been around for a very long time.

And that is where they have come out as far as allowing auto dealers the freedom to operate but still making sure that we are protecting consumers.

>> Thank you.

Ms. Wells, what is ballot security, and what if anything, should Indiana do to safeguard it?

>> So much of the questions that are around elections come down to security.

And how safe are the measures.

I will say that in the state of Indiana elections have been safe and secure throughout leaders.

Indiana has great safeguard on the process.

As far as ballot security, as a -- almost 20 year now military officer in military intelligence with the army reserve, a lot of my background is in information security.

And cyber security.

Right now Indiana is part of a cyber security program where it safeguards ballots in so that personal information is not being leaked on and also not susceptible to outside attacks.

I would like to continue those efforts in making sure that ballots are safe.

>> Thank you, Ms. Wells and Mr. Maher same question, what is ballot security and should Indiana do anything to safeguard it?

>> That's being able to track your vote to, see it was counted, received and audited to be able to follow it through that process.

Ballot security also means all the back end technologies, processes, people and protocols that ensure that privacy and right now we have these flashing red warning signs that suggest, yes, things are okay but there are areas that we should tighten up so if you've ever moved into a new home or a new apartment you know one of the fistFISfist -- first things you are supposed to do is change the locks.

It secures that vulnerability and you know our elections process around our ballots, we have countless vulnerabilities.

Both physical paper ballots and even more in digital electronic ballots.

We can ensure that every ballot cast has at least a paper backup.

Right now the minority only 40% have any kind of paper backup whatsoever.

>> Thank you.

Ms. Wells, I offer you a 30 second rebuttal.

>> I would like to say that there has not been any evidence put forward that Indiana is not already protecting its vulnerabilities when it comes to cyber security and information security with voting.

There have been multiple attacks but the Secretary of State's office has put forward the evidence that they have encountered those and dealt with them accordingly.

That is why it is so important to be operating again from a fact based place so we are not perpetuating there is a problem when one does not exist.

>> Thank you.

>> The Los Angeles DA made an arrest of a CEO of a software company called poll chief and this was this past week and that software is factually used in Indiana so we don't know the details yet.

The indictment is still sealed but right now we know there is a vulnerability.

We have to investigate, understand and ensure that we are working diligently to actively and aggressively secure these vulnerabilities.

>> Thank you.

The independent state legislature theory suggests that state legislature should have a more substantial role in regulating federal elections.

More extreme versions would minimize the Secretary of State's office.

Could you please share your perspective on this idea and the implications for the office.

We'll begin with Mr. Maher.

>> It's very clear from our U.S. Constitution that voting is a state's right.

It belong with us.

The county is serving its local needs best.

The needs from one county radio -- are different from another.

That's the best way to serve the needs of each local community the federal level and the federalization of our elections is tantamount to not only taking them from us, but also in introducing all kinds of new vulnerabilities and new components that will complicate and stymie our ability to choose our leaders.

>> Thank you, the same question, can you share your perspective on this idea.

>> So the independent state legislature theory is just that.

A theory.

It is not doctrine and so it will be heard by a supreme court this fall.

I want to go one step further about the ISL theory though and the problems it could give individual states.

It is about cutting out a state's judiciary.

And so the ISL theory could be a very slippery slope it has people talking about it all around the country again, it is just that, a theory.

It is surprising that the supreme court is even taking it up and people should be watching it with alarm.

>> I will allow 30 seconds from a rebuttal.

>> If you like I am from the federal government and I'm here to help.

This is your solution.

>> Thank you.

Ms. Wells, would you like 30 second for a rebuttal.

>> Our country has been founded on interaction between the federal government and the state government working together.

You know what I have served in the military, like I said, for almost 20 years.

That is a federal organization.

And I do not feel that I am an evil person because I served on behalf of our country and I was led by the federal government.

I am in fact very proud and I think we can work together for better solutions for a stronger democracy.

>> Thank you.

Ms. Wells, we'll start with you on the next question, can you describe the responsibility of the continuing care of retirement communities and can the office do more.

>> When there is a community they have to work with the Secretary of State for a one time certification in making sure they are doing all the things they should be doing and having an adequate community that serves our older generation.

And so, with that community, we want to make sure that we are working with these communities but also checking in on them because like I said it is a one time deal where they are signed off on, but we could do better in making sure that we are checking in, especially when we know that problems arise because of the vulnerability of our older population and being taken advantage of.

>> Thank you, Ms. Wells, Mr. Maher, same question about continuing care and protection to the consumer.

>> Sure let's talk about protection to consumer, the residents of these communities in light of their ballot.

My grandmother lived in a facility like this for years and she lived in the Alzheimer's ward because that's what she had and so magically some group had come through and taken her vote, her signature and submitted it for her and so we don't know who that was or what they voted for for her but there they were operating on the ward, an Alzheimer's ward of a senior or continuing care facility.

That's an unconscionable abuse of their right, not only their right as a consumer but their right as a voter.

And to think about how my grandmother's ballot access was taken from her by some unknown group that's what we need to sopTOto stop.

That's one of the many vulnerabilities that we need to address.

>> Thank you Mr. Maher, my next question involves voter fraud and if it's a concern to Indiana.

>> Voter fraud happens all the time.

Someone just reached out to the campaign because they thought they had voted and it turns out they were declined because of some kind of transposition of a birth date and so that's one simple version.

We have nearly one and a half registered voters for every voting number.

And that means there are millions of votes that can be cast by people who aren't voting, requiring a photo ID protects the non-voter, the person who can or not vote or chooses not to because like identity theft it prohibits someone from taking your identity and stealing your vote.

>> Thank you, Ms. Wells, is voter fraud a concern in Indiana?

>> Voter fraud should always be looked at by the Secretary of State and made sure we are doing everything we can do to safeguard against it but we see that as far as voter fraud there is not been a large organized concerted effort of voter fraud for partisan gain what we see though is there have been isolated incidents of voter fraud in the past.

I will even mention an example, one of our republican Secretary of States committed voter fraud.

Was indicted and sent to jail and so we can deal with voter fraud when it occurs but we should not be perpetuating that there is this huge voter fraud problem when we have no evidence to support it.

>> Thank you.

Ms. Wells, what role should the Secretary of State's office have in training clerks and eelection volunteers in conducting elections in Indiana.

>> One of the things I take the -- that I am so happy to have been able to do is to set down with the executive board and to get to know them.

Clerks where multiple hat s. They have to also be there for the courts.

And so with elections, that is not the only thing they are doing.

They need support from the Secretary of State's office because TLER the boots on the ground.

And every time that a party or an actor perpetuates these falsehoods they make the clerk's jobs harder because they are intercepting the phone calls of concerned citizens who have been led astray with misand disinformation and so when it comes to clerk's training we will continue forward.

How they have been doing business but we will also make sure that we are supporting them every step of the way.

>> Thank you, Ms. Wells.

Same question, what role should the clerks have?

>> The only falsehood is believing that everything is perfect.

That's delusional.

What instead we need to do is focus on making things better.

There's proof that things aren't working right because in 2020 and 2016 both losers of those elections claimed the other party stole the election.

A good election is one in which the loser accepts the results, not because they like the outcome but because they trust the process.

And so by that metric, our elections are failing us not party, not false HOODZ so we have to focus on the training for our clerks.

For our poll workers, for our Election Day workers so that they have the tools and the transparency to help all of us trust and restore trust in our elections again.

Some of that just imagine stepping into a new job as a clerk, where you have to be the expert and maybe your staff is just one other person.

We have to look to the clerk community and see other states to guide us for what that training should be and then aggressively offer that and include that as part of the on boarding and for all of the Election Day workers.

>> Thank you, I will offer you a rebuttal.

>> I am going to have to counter with validating people's beliefs that the elections were stolen and their behavior was appropriate.

It absolutely was not.

We can't say that it's the process that is the problem.

We have people acting irresponsibly who are power hungry and can't accept results because they don't want to give up power.

We have to face that head on and fight with good information and evidence.

>> Thank you, Ms. Wells.

>> We can fight with good information evidence with a comprehensive audit.

A top to bottom audit with everything that we do.

Every ballot that comes in.

That is how we are going to dispel that kind of bad behavior by shining sunlight into dark places.

We need a comprehensive, independent audit of all 92 counties before the elections are certified.

>> Thank you, Mr. Maher.

A recent studied published by the nonpartisan coalition of integrity ranked Indiana 51 in terms this.

How can they improve finance activities.

>> Sure.

We saw it right here in Indiana our current sitting Secretary of State violated campaign finance laws by soliciting donations at a time that was prohibited because legislature was still in session.

Our campaign finance laws are complicated and written by the two party system to make it complicated for everyone and particularly for all third parties so simplifying them but also allowing for greater transparency so that way we can understand who our conditionedandidates are.

>> Same question, what role does the Secretary of State have in improving finance laws.

>> The Secretary of State is essentially the campaign finance administrator and what we see and like the study in reference where we are 51 out of Allstates and DC is because it is a bit of the wild, wild west in Indiana when it come to campaign finance.

That why Jeff and I bought a -- almost 44,000 dollar car with donor money but didn't have any repercussions.

Our statutes have no teeth.

They have no enforcement and so whereas the Secretary of State and the XHAEN campaign finance administrator we can start to message with the legislature that we need a strength our campaign finance statutes and we also need to make sure that we are holding especially candidates and committees, and PACs responsible for what they are doing.

You just can't file a report and say I checked the box and I'm good to go.

There has to be a bit of an investigation to make sure everybody is doing the right thing.

>> Thank you, Ms. Wells, the next question is for you, first, how will you share that all 92 counties in Indiana will follow federal and state voting laws in the same manner.

>> Well, so I believe that the 92 counties have overall done a very good job.

It is not easy is to be on the board.

There are those bombard with requests for more information because people believe in these conspiracy theories about elections and so I would continue to help them in the ways that they have been helped but also a point of leadership, right?

So, again, I was so excited when I sat down with the clerks because having come from one of the largest organizations in the world, the Department of Defense, I am used to a lot of bureaucracy and red tape and I love working with soldiers.

So just like that I would love working with the clerks and making sure we do the best we can across all 92 counties in making sure that they have the best information in and the most up-to-date technology available to them and best practices.

>> Thank you.

Same question.

>> We need to do an audit.

Not to punish them but to actually see how are we doing things and what can we be doing better?

And that means looking at the processes, looking at the technologies, their people, resources and saying you need more help and we need to give you more resources that is the solution.

That's the pathway forward.

We need to know what to work on just like a father helping a son learn how to swing a baseball bat.

We need to review the process and find ways to constantly make it better and we're going to do that with a comprehensive risk limiting audit of all 92 counties.

That's the best way to understand where we're coming up short or how to do better.

>> Ms. Wells, would you like a 30 second rebuttal.

>> We don't help them by giving them more things to do.

This 92 county audit may sound like a great thing but if we do our jobs on the front end as Secretary of States we couldn't have to have 92 county audits.

Audits are to catch mistakes and a system shouldn't be riddled with mistakes.

We should be able to have a system that functions the right way the first time around.

>> Thank you, and Mr. Maher, 30 seconds for you as well.

>> That's wishful thinking and we see it where there's audits and control boards and the reality is, these organizations are complicated and systems and processes are complicated.

That's why we need to check it and review it and only by understanding what is working and what is not working that is how we'll make it better.

>> Thank you.

A tough study that came out right before the 2020 election showed Indiana with a steep drop in 18-19-year-old registrants.

What would you do to promote registrant turnout among the young voters and Mr. Maher, we will begin with you.

>> Our youngest voters are used to opening up their phones and having a world, a globe of choices on their phones.

We can order pizzas online, pay our taxes, we can bank, trade crypto currencies, all of these things are possible and all choices on one small screen and part of that frustration is we only have one option.

Literally an unopposed candidate and the best way to encourage voter turnout and participation and young people who are interested in voting for more, for something that's to give them someone to vote for.

To give them more parties, more options, more candidates, let's have some competition on our ballot.

>> Thank you Mr. Maher.

What would you do to promote registration and turnout among the youngest Hoosier voters.

>> We have to acknowledge history and that is that in 2008, Barack Obama when he was seeking the -- to be president, was largely successful with young Hoosiers.

He buckled down and he made sure that he trayed to triple the registrations for the youth.

What you saw after that was a concerted effort to limit access for youth to the ballot.

Voting centers were moved off of campus.

The transportation issues keep young voters from voting and so what we need to be doing is, again, like I said earlier, is not being afraid of voters.

Not being afraid of the youth.

They are our future.

We have to be talking to them.

Asking them, what is your voting experience?

How about a college advisory board with a Secretary of State?

We have a brain drain in Indiana and we need to civically engage our youth as soon as we can and that is being registered and involved in the political process.

>> Thank you.

This will be by last question before we go to closing remarks.

Can you explain to all perspective vote theirs are watching tonight why you are the best candidate for this position?

>> I have gone throughout the state and talked about this position and that it is an office that traditionally is technocratic and administrative.

It is only after 2020 that we have seen Secretary of State offices be contested, specifically by election deniers.

In Indiana we have an election denier running with the republican party.

Hoosiers should be voting for the candidate that is prodemocracy and I am the only one on the ballot this year.

I have said over and over tonight that we must be operating from a fact based evidence-based place.

That is the only way I know to function.

I have held a top secret security clearance for the last 16 years as a military officer and it is with honor and pride that I operate from that perspective.

From being evidence-based.

From the facts.

And I again, like I said, am the only prodemocracy candidate.

>> Okay.

Thank you very much.

Mr. Maher, the same question for you.

Can you explain to all perspective voters watching why you're the best candidate.

>> Sure.

My career is in finance and technology.

I worked with internal audit to implement strong accounting controls.

These are the good common sense tools that will give us the insight to let us know that our elections are performing as they need to but let's address the 800 pound gorilla not in the room tonight.

Healthy democracies need healthy debate and candidates who refuse to debate are assuming that they've won the election and they don't even need to listen to you.

There's a candidate who refused to debate in 2000, 2004, 2018.

His name is Vladimir Putin and for candidate who is refuse to debate the company you keep is Vladimir Putin.

>> To both candidates I thank you.

We have run out of time for closing remarks and to the audience, I want to thank you all for joining us here this evening.

To hear the candidates for our chief election officer the Indiana Secretary of State.

We want to thank WFYI for producing this debate.

Thank you so much for tuning in.

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