- PNC is proud to support "Business Forward" where community leaders discuss the issues confronting business in central Illinois.

(upbeat music) (cheerful music) (cheerful music continues) - Welcome to "Business Forward."

I'm your host, Matt George.

Joining me tonight, good friend of mine, Chad Manbeck.

Chad is the Lead Pastor at Richwoods Christian Church.

Welcome.

- Thanks for having me.

I appreciate it.

- Well, I mean, you do some awesome things in this community.

And I started thinking about what would make a great show.

I've never had someone talk about the business of a church, so I wanna talk about that, but I wanna talk about you for a sec.

- Sure.

- So you grew up in Ohio.

- [Chad] I did.

- So what are some of your best memories of growing up in Ohio?

- Some of my best memories were I became a Michigan fan (Matt laughs) living in Ohio.

- Okay.

- At the age of, like, six.

- All right.

- I had a blue and yellow birthday cake, connected it to the football team that was on TV.

And said, "Man, that's my team."

My uncle still tells my mom, that was your worst parenting job ever.

- [Matt] That is funny.

- But growing up in Ohio, being a Michigan fan, you got the Ohio State always made an interesting place to live.

I'm from a divorced home.

My parents were separated when I was really young, so I remember Ohio with a lot of hurt, a lot of pain, a lot of overcoming.

And I always knew, and it's a key part of my story, I always knew I didn't wanna stay in Ohio.

I enjoyed my childhood.

I got through it.

- Okay.

- But I always knew I wanna move.

I wanna see what's out there.

I wanna explore the country and the world, if possible.

And so that became a key part of my story growing up in Ohio, was, it was a small town, and I really wanted to see what cities were like.

- Now, you're talking to an Illini guy.

You know that?

- Yeah.

- Okay, all right, I'm just joking.

- So Illini's okay.

It's the Ohio State that's the problem.

- It's the Ohio State, right?

- Yeah, yeah.

- So, well, now one of our friends, Brian Ray, I bet you guys have some good talking back and forth with PNC.

He's an Ohio State guy.

He loves Ohio.

- We do.

And it's probably the only contentious part of our relationship.

(Matt laughs) We put grace on that thing and that's how we get through.

- That is so funny.

So when did you know you wanted to be a pastor?

'Cause I find it interesting that everybody I talk to that's in your profession has a different story.

- Yeah.

- It's pretty cool.

- It does kind of happen in various ways.

I didn't grow up in church.

It's not something my family did.

My mom believed there was a God, but me and my dad played golf on the weekend, so.

- Okay.

- If we were praying, we were praying out on the golf course on Sundays.

(laughing) And so I went to college and what I really wanted to be was an accountant.

I wanted to be up in a high rise working for a business.

And at 22, Jesus intersected my life and really showed me that man, He died for me.

He loves me.

And I kind of felt like, man, someone who loves me that much, I'm gonna love him back.

And so I started going to church, started figuring out what a relationship with God was like.

And in that process, I fell in love with the local church.

And for me, it really started with not like a call.

You'll hear that all the time in our vocation.

A call- - Yeah.

- to ministry.

It wasn't a call to be a pastor or a lead pastor, it was more of a desire.

I wanted to work in a church because the church helped change my life.

- [Matt] Okay.

- And so I was like, janitor, you know, whatever, - You didn't care.

- I didn't care, whatever.

And so, about 25, 26 years old, right around the time I met my wife, I really decided, hey, I think I can serve people.

There's still a business side to the church so I loved that.

- [Matt] A big business side.

- Big business side, right.

- Right.

- And so I thought, man, I can still take my business side and use it for the benefit of the church.

And that kind of launched me into a new education direction and a new pursuit for vocation.

- It's kind of cool you say that because when you think about wanting to be an accountant, numbers, you need to know numbers being in your position at the church.

- For sure.

- Right?

- Yeah.

- So I don't like talking about COVID anymore, but the one thing in your business that seemed to change and not, and this is everywhere, was the hybrid- - Yeah.

- Church.

- You know, you could sit at home in your pajamas and drink your coffee and watch it on your iPad.

- Yeah.

- And that counts as church.

It seems odd to me.

But is the future still that?

Is it ever gonna go away?

- I don't think online is going away.

- Yeah.

- I think it would be a great, even mistake by the church and any business to act like online doesn't matter.

- [Matt] Okay.

- We don't even go to restaurants anymore without an online, you know, research, right.

Why am I gonna go in blind when I can read what it looks like?

And so what we're experiencing at Richwoods, and I think this would be across the board at churches, is online can be a platform that is used to even elevate the in-person experience.

And so what we try to do is give you what you're going to experience if you come in person, but give you a form of it online.

So you can watch me teach and say, kind of like him, or I don't, and I'll go somewhere else.

I kind of like the worship, or I don't, I'm gonna go somewhere else.

And so it's much like the restaurant business.

You can see like, am I interested in their menu?

- Right.

- And like it or not, most people will choose a church based on preference.

And so online has been a great tool for us to put out there, here, here's what we do best.

But particularly at Richwoods, we want to make sure that everyone knows the best expression we believe of the church is in person.

- [Matt] Yes.

- It's a relational experience.

- [Matt] I agree.

- And so we believe that watching at home can be for if you're sick, if you're out of town, or if you want to check us out, and you can just check us out.

But come in person, that's where you'll find out the real church.

- You know, a question just popped in my head about, so from a business standpoint with what you just said, and if other churches had that same mentality, which a lot of 'em do, you have to hire now social media people and website people.

- [Chad] Absolutely.

- Because how's somebody like me and you gonna stay on top of that?

- That's right, that's right.

There's content.

Content creation is a massive piece of the church now.

We are storytellers and stories, Jesus was great at it, right.

He's one of the greatest storytellers that ever lived.

And stories help people take what maybe was really hard to understand about heaven or about God and he made stories so we could understand them with our finite mind.

- Yeah.

- And now we get to do that.

We get to take the story of the church, the story of people, and make it available.

Social media is a great platform for that, where we can tell stories on a daily basis and it really gives you a snapshot of what God's doing.

- Yeah.

So I, you know, I find the business of churches interesting in so many aspects.

Like you have issues just like every other business.

- [Chad] That's right.

- So one of the things that I've wondered about your business is how do you deal with criticism?

Because if you're a man of faith and you're thinking one way, and someone's ripping on you another way- - Right.

- how do you deal with that?

- It's hard.

- I bet.

- It's hard.

And COVID didn't help us.

- Yeah.

And racial tension didn't help us.

And political tension didn't help us.

It was already complicated 'cause you're dealing with spiritual matters and people have a wide variety of opinions on who's right and who's wrong, and what's the way.

Now, it was are you mask or unmask?

And there's no right answer.

There's a right answer for 50% of the people.

Are you Republican, Democrat, somewhere in between?

There's no right answer.

And so for us, in particular in my position, it's really hard to not let the one criticism outweigh the 99 stories- - That's right.

- of God's working.

And so for me, I think one of the key things I do is I slow down.

- Okay.

- One of the things that's really helped me in leadership, especially of the business side of the church, is to take those criticisms, take those feedbacks, whether they come from outside or within, and really slow down.

Listen, read them.

Don't take it personal 'cause the chances are whoever was sitting in my seat was gonna take the dart anyway.

Right?

- Right.

- And so it doesn't matter who's sitting here, you're gonna get shot at.

And slow down and listen to what really people are saying.

- [Matt] Yeah.

- A friend, acquaintance of mine, Steven Carter, wrote a great book called "The Thing Beneath the Thing."

And I think when you're handling criticism that's a key thing to stop and do.

What is the thing beneath the thing?

What is this person trying to tell me?

How is this person hurting that's causing them- - I gotcha.

- to hurt.

Because often what they're saying is not the most important issue.

- [Matt] Right.

- It's usually, especially with COVID, we learned most of it's based in fear.

We were afraid.

- Right.

- It was unknown.

And so we just wanted to feel safe again.

- And safe's the keyword.

I was just gonna say that people need to be safe at all times.

- Yes.

- So- - Especially in the church where you should walk in and you are almost expecting this to be the safest place in the world because it's founder was the safest human being that ever lived.

He welcomed children, those who were hurting.

- [Matt] Right.

- Sinners, Republicans, all of it.

He welcomed them in and said, you can sit with me in safety and we can have a conversation.

- [Matt] Yeah.

- So the church is expected to be that.

- I like how I went to one of your services a month ago and you said, we don't deal with, I'm putting words in your mouth, we don't deal with noise or garbage, whatever it is, you keep anything political, anything, all that, keep it outside of here.

This is a safe place.

- That's right.

- Yeah, I love it.

So, typical day for you.

It's kind of funny because on one of the services, my little boy said, "Where's he at?"

(Chad laughs) And because, you know, you have other pastors and you have youth pastors and- - Yeah.

- You know.

I go, "Honey, he's busy."

I go, "He does a lot of things during the week."

But people don't think that."

- Yeah.

- They just think you're- - I'm the one day- - I work on Sundays.

- One day a week guy.

(laughing) - Yeah.

That'd be an awesome job.

- Could you imagine?

- I'd be up for that.

- Yeah.

So time management, how do you deal with everybody coming at you with crisis all the time?

Not all the time, but a lot of it, you have to hear it daily.

- Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

I run a pretty rigid schedule.

Kind of a schedule, you know, guy who runs a really tight schedule from thing to thing.

I also have specific blocks of time that are very protected.

Tuesday is a great example of, Tuesday's my study, sermon prep day.

It's all day.

No meetings, no interference.

- Okay.

- I'm pretty much untouchable on Tuesdays so that I can focus on the Word of God, prayer and preparing for the following Sunday.

I do that on Tuesdays.

Some guys do it, you know, guys do it later in the week.

Then from there it's really making sure that I'm balanced.

For me, there's always crisis.

There's always marriages that are hurting.

There's always mental health issues.

- [Matt] Right.

- There's always relational issues.

And if you have too much of that on your schedule, you're just a human being.

I'm a human being with a wife and also five children.

- [Matt] Yeah.

- And so I've got enough crisis of my own to deal with.

But if I put too much of that on my schedule, it gets really hard to be the shepherd that I want to be.

- [Matt] Right.

- When people are coming, most of the time I understand that they didn't get here yesterday, whatever the issue is.

They didn't get here yesterday.

And so I'm not gonna be able to solve it today.

We need a long journey in the right direction.

And it's possible, and this happens decent amount, that the church isn't always the answer.

We've started to believe that the church is the answer for everything.

- [Matt] Yeah.

- And so, but the truth is, there are trained professionals in certain areas, like counseling and mental health, and they're there for a reason.

And we as the church, need to utilize those people's gifts and talents instead of trying to always handle it ourselves.

And so that's a big, big focus of ours at Richwoods, is we will direct you to counseling if that is what you need.

If you need biblical care, we provide that.

If you need marriage counseling, we can do that in house.

If you need a marriage mentor, we can do that.

But there are things you deal with in life that there are programs and people who are well trained that can handle better than us.

- I like how you said that, because I think a lot of times, I mean, you took my next question, physical and mental health issues.

But the mental health piece, especially after COVID is just skyrocketed.

- Yeah.

- And, you know, you look at everyone, even you, you have issues.

You say five kids, you know, I was gonna say preaching to the choir, but that then I was gonna say, no pun intended, it was a bad joke.

(Chad laughs) But, you know, five kids, you've got something going on with your kids at all times, or your wife, or your job, whatever it may be.

So I find that, because I used to think that, there was a pastor that I knew a while ago, and he's retired now, but I used to think, really, he's kind of just a counselor.

You know, he really just, all he does is just talk to people nonstop and just makes 'em feel good.

- [Chad] Yeah.

'Cause that's what it, kind of what the perception is.

- Yeah, it definitely isn't.

- [Matt] Right.

(chuckles) - I think if you use the shepherd analogy.

- Okay.

- I think it's the best way to view what people like me do.

- Okay.

- Is taking, we're all sheep and sometimes we need protecting, sometimes we need provision, sometimes we just need, hey, come in the corral here and be safe.

Problems aren't solved, the world is still out there, but I just need to get you to stop spiraling.

And I find that a lot of times that is what some of our pastors on staff do the best.

I've got a few pastors on staff that are just amazing at helping the whirlpool just stop.

Someone has to stop.

- You need to slow down.

- Even slow down, right.

And so coming alongside people and just saying, Hey, let's slow your world down.

It's probably not as bad as you think it is.

It's probably not as urgent as you think it is.

- [Matt] Right.

- And if God is God, then- - Yeah.

He will shepherd you through.

And I think that is different than counseling where it's advice and direction.

It's more of protection and care.

- [Matt] Yeah.

- And bits of wisdom when they're given from God to give to people for sure.

- Very well said.

Thinking that as a CEO, cause that's really what you are.

- [Chad] Sure.

- As a CEO, you've gotta also be a fundraiser.

Now, I know it's different in a church.

- [Chad] Right.

- But in a sense, you're raising money because you have to bring in revenue streams to pay for your great staff.

- That's right.

- The more staff you have, the more people you can help.

- True.

- Right?

- Yeah.

- So when you, I go back to that hybrid question of you've really had to become a fundraiser.

And I say that differently than just passing the basket.

- [Chad] Yeah.

- Because now if people are staying home some, they're not sitting there putting $25 into the basket, right?

- Right.

- So there has to be other ways, and that's where your team comes into play.

I mean, you've gotta donate now, you've got to do all of this online stuff that wasn't like that 10 years ago.

- Right.

- Is that just crazy?

- Yeah, well, and the majority of our giving, almost, I mean the majority, like almost all of it is not given Sunday morning in a box or a basket.

We don't even pass the basket anymore.

We just have boxes in the back of the room.

- [Matt] Yeah, yeah.

- And the majority of our offering is not coming through that.

It's coming through online recurring gifts, or giving from the app, or whatever.

- Planned giving.

- Planned giving, things like that, right.

And so for me as a fundraiser, my biggest, I think, responsibility is vision and mission and culture.

- [Matt] Love it.

- Is making sure that our people, who we want to be joy-filled givers, that's the term we use at Richwoods.

We want you to joyfully give.

And so if you can joyfully give $5, but not 10, then give five, right.

It's about the heart.

Jesus never took an offering, but he always wanted your 100% of your heart.

And so we try to, or I in particular, try to cast vision and direction of what God is doing and what you can be a part of in Jesus' name.

- [Matt] Yeah.

- And so when you give, we want you to give in Jesus' name.

That may be to a nonprofit in town, it may be to our church, but just give somewhere in Jesus's name.

And vision, mission and culture really create that.

That's the message.

It's not standing up and saying, give because I said so, or because the Bible said 10%.

It's, here's what God is doing at Richwoods and of course it takes money to make that happen, and you can be a part of that mission, but we want you to do it joyful because God wants your heart before he wants your wallet.

- Talking about mission, helping people find and follow Christ.

- Yeah.

- Very simple.

- Very simple.

And there's actually three parts to it, not two.

- [Matt] Okay.

- It's very easy to look at our mission.

This is something that, I've changed a lot of things about Richwoods Christian Church since I've been here and God has lead.

But this is the one thing that I knew from the day I first interviewed I would never change because it captures everything that I believe the church should be about.

We know that we're about helping people find Jesus.

Of course, that's what we're supposed to do.

We want to help those who don't know Jesus, have a relationship with Jesus through the death and resurrection of Jesus.

And then of course we should help them follow Jesus.

We don't want you to make a one-time decision, but we want this to be generational where your, you and your wife, and your children, and their children follow Jesus all their life.

One of the key pieces that I think we can easily miss in our mission is helping people.

It's the first two words that at the bare minimum, Jesus always helped people.

- Yeah.

- No matter what they chose.

- [Matt] Yeah.

- Because some people will choose to follow Him, some chose not to.

Some will choose to come to Richwoods, some will not.

Some will ridicule us, some will celebrate us.

But we can always help people.

- Yeah.

- And so as long as we're helping people, we are as much like Jesus as we can be.

And so those first two words are just as important as the rest of the statement.

Even though it's all important.

- I'm speaking today at a luncheon and that's my talk.

It's your job to help people.

That's the title of my speech.

It's your duty to take care of our community, period.

That's how I feel.

- It is not, I believe with all my heart, it is not the organization called Richwoods Christian Church to help people, it is every individual- - That's right, I agree.

- that attends that church, that lives in this community, that has an address in this community.

I mean, if we did that, if we just helped people, no matter their belief system, no matter their structure, you would see a different Peoria anytime.

- Yeah.

You and your wife, Jenna, you moved here a few years ago.

And what makes you wanna come to a community like this?

- That's a good question.

- Yeah.

- We moved to Las Vegas about 2017.

At that time, we were a family of four.

We moved there to work at a very large church and started another campus for them.

And while we were there, God placed on our heart that we had more love to give as my son put it.

And so we decided that would look like us adopting three children, siblings set of three.

And we adopted them and they became a part of our home four or five years ago.

And when we were coming through COVID, we were in Vegas at the beginning, and we knew God was probably moving us in a direction for me to lead pastor.

It had been on my heart for a while, wanted to lead an organization, that business guy and an organism of the church.

And so as we started to look, Richwoods reached out to us and the head hunter organization thought we would be a good fit for this church.

And it really, I was attracted to the city.

One, there's diversity here in the high 28%, you know, African American.

I have three African American children.

So being able to find their culture, being able to have my girls' hair done, being able to take my boy to the shop, that stuff was important to me.

My wife is from the Midwest so coming back to the Midwest was attractive.

But we wanted to make sure we were in a community that was representative of all of us.

And so Peoria offered that, which was kind of cool.

And then the church was in a place where it had gone two years without a leader.

And it needed a fresh vision, fresh direction.

And part of who I am as Enneagram eight, and the way I'm built is I love to fix things.

I love to take things that aren't quite right and fix them.

- [Matt] Yep.

- And so we adopted three kids to fix it.

We have moved to different churches to help fix them.

And this was a beautiful opportunity to take something that I thought, I saw Richwoods as a gold mine that can make a huge impact in Peoria.

- [Matt] Yeah.

- That could be an amazing beacon of light and a joyous respite for the city to come into.

And so it was really just an honor and privilege to even have the opportunity- - Isn't that neat.

- to lead that?

And so that's what pulled us here.

- Yeah, that's a pretty neat story.

So you have a lot of values with the church.

I'm just gonna name off off a few, but I want to tell you one that.

So completely dependent, welcome everyone, joy-filled givers, see others, pursue engagement, vibrant together.

The one I like walk unashamed.

- Yeah.

- Explain that real quick.

- Shame is easy.

- Yeah.

- I think in some sense every human being carries some of it.

- Yeah.

- No matter how small or how big.

Some of it's shame from things that have been done to us, especially children.

Some of it's shame for what we aren't, rather than looking at what we are.

Very few of us have ever heard, you are enough and you have what it takes.

Even as adults.

I've met adults here in this city that when I say that to them, they're like, Man, I should tell my children that, but I've never heard that.

They're grown adults, 40 years old, have never heard you are enough and you have what it takes.

Because they look in the mirror and they carry some form of shame around how they're made, and who they are, and what they're passionate about.

So it was key for us to have a value that said, Hey, in the eyes of God, we walk unashamed.

Not that we don't repent of sin and we don't try and do right, but that we walk unashamed of who he's made us.

That we are called to be who we are.

And the gifts, and talents, and abilities, and mind, and skillset we have are specifically given to us to live in wherever he directs us.

And so we try and encourage our people, it's a key piece of our discipleship, that when you look in the mirror, the most powerful you, you can be for the kingdom, the most impact you can make for God is to be unashamed of who He's made you to be.

It's hugely formative.

And so we're getting people to ask the question, Man, do I have what it takes?

- Right.

- Am I really enough?

- [Matt] Right.

- Because there is such freedom when you can look and say, that's me.

- That's nice.

- All the good, bad and ugly.

- That's nice.

You know, I picked the right one to talk about.

- Yeah.

- That's pretty nice stuff.

So I would just wanna tell you, you have done so much in a short period of time in this community.

You've reached out.

I talk to leaders all the time, and I have people telling me, I know Chad, I know Chad.

And that is very meaningful being in my position that I've been in and because I still consider myself that community guy.

So I wanna thank you for coming on.

I want to say keep going because, and I never want you to move.

I mean, I love middle Illinois.

I love it.

But you are awesome, keep caring.

Pastor Chad Manbeck.

This wraps another show.

I'm Matt George and this is "Business Forward."

(upbeat music) (upbeat music continues) (upbeat music continues) (upbeat music continues) (upbeat music continues) - Thank you for tuning into "Business Forward," brought to you by PNC.

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