- Consider This, lots of people use the phrase "I'd take a bullet to" describe the level of sacrifice they're willing to make for someone or something they care about.

But imagine if one of the very tenants of your job require that you'd be willing and able to take that bullet if the situation actually called for it.

I know for me, that would make me think twice about using that phrase so casually, but for my guest her thought was bring it on.

To grow up in Colorado and athletic young woman and become one of the first five female secret service agents in the United States as quite a feat.

But she's also a mother of broadcaster, a speaker and community service advocate.

I'm Yvonne Greer.

And my guest is Kathryn Childers retired secret service agent.

Next on Consider This.

(upbeat music) I was really excited to get to meet my next guests because it would have never crossed my mind in my lifetime to consider myself a secret service agent.

But that's exactly what Kathryn Childersdid.

Welcome to Consider This.

- So nice to be here.

Thank you.

- So as a young girl growing up in Colorado did you have a thought what made you get on that path to begin with?

- Well, really all I wanted to do was grow up and be a cowgirl.

And my, my first rearing, my first growing up was in little tiny town of pleasant Grove, Utah.

And there weren't many role models for girls in the mid fifties.

And Annie Oakley just seemed like such a remarkable woman.

She, we read about her in stories are on the movies and this kind of thing.

As a woman who started really from nothing supported her family when they were in destitute times, by being such a good shooter a long gun shooter that she could actually shoot rabbits and whatever kind of thing to support and feed her family.

But she was so good that she ended up in the Buffalo bill wild west show and is said to have been such a talent with this shooting skill that she could split cards through the middle and she'd throw them up and put it through the ACE hall heart.

I mean, remarkable.

Well, I didn't know that much, but I just knew I wanted to be Annie Oakley.

- And you wanted to shoot.

- Well, I had to if I was gonna be Annie Oakley, I, and I went to my father and I said daddy, I need to learn how to shoot the old 22.

This wasn't for hunting purposes.

He had an old 22 to shoot varmints and whatever and I knew it was in the closet and it, it the closet that I was never to go into, you know that smelled musty and had oil and a little box of funny green and white, a little green and white white box with little shells with copper tips.

And I said, would you teach me how to shoot the, the old 22?

And he said today?

- I said, yes, today, I'm in a hurry.

I need to be Annie Oakley.

I had the dog, I had the horse.

I had even have the fringe jacket, which I still have because I framed it Yvonne.

Anything you want to keep when you're all like out frame it you got it.

So he picked up the, put some of these little shells in his pocket and took the old gun.

And we went down to the back 40 so to speak and he put a cannon.

I brought my cannanon, I didn't bring my cam but I put a tin can on the post.

And he said, okay.

And he gave me the, the old 22.

And he said, no, snug it into your shoulder and look down there.

And there's a little red dot.

And he said, download@thebottomwherethatlittlered.is aim at the bottom of the can.

And then squeeze, squeeze, not unlike how they taught me to shoot in the secret service.

And he said, and I'm going I can't tears rolling down my face.

I'm about eight.

So - Was it because you weren't strong enough to squeeze it or, you know - I could have, but I, what I proclaimed at that point was daddy.

I'm just, and the emphasis here is I'm just scared.

I'm just scared, which was a fallback position for many young women, little girls in those days that just being scared was fine.

So you stepped back, you did what you were supposed to do.

You played with dolls, you certainly didn't wanna become any Oakley.

And he took the gun back and he said, that's okay.

You're you're little.

And he said, plus, you're just a girl.

Well, wait A minute, girl, those were, the Dem was fighting words But he said, maybe you're just too young.

And I said, no, no, I'm just scared.

So he put the gun back in my shoulder helped me raise it up and look at the site.

And he patted me on the head and he said, "Then honey just do it scared if you really want to do it."

And I have I speak about the fact that it was a brief period in my life being in the secret service.

But by adopting that mantra early on as a little girl it opened up incredible opportunities for me that other girls never tried.

I ended up being on a rifle team in high school, we moved to Colorado.

That's where the Colorado story started.

There were no team sports for girls in 1960.

When I started high school, I graduated in 65 no team sports until title nine, there was no basketball.

There was no volleyball.

There were no, there was nothing for women physically, other than being a cheerleader, which I, we were laughing about.

I wasn't a good jumper that w and there were only five.

There were only five girls that were on the cheerleading squad.

- So you started a rifle team.

No, remarkably.

They had one, probably the only one in the state an old woman named teach Wentworth had started this rifle team many years in a musty old basement range in the bottom of the high school.

And she saw me shooting baskets months or Dodge ball or something that they let girls play.

Cause I was a skier.

I was a tennis player.

I was athletic in those days.

They called us a tom boy.

They probably would've said I was an Olympic hopeful To say, cause I was Athletic.

- She said, why don't you try out for my girls rifle team the Centennial high school bulldogs, girls rifle team.

She said, you've got gumption.

I think you'd be good at it.

Do you know how to shoot?

And I said, well my dad shot taught me how to shoot cans off the post.

And she said, come on down.

And I ended up joining the team and being one of the best shots in the state.

- Wow.

What a pivotal and poignant moment though For your dad to tell you.

Okay, so you're scared Do it scared Because I think that's a stopper for so many of us and in so many walks of life, the thing that frightens us almost I would imagine is now the thing you would probably say is the thing that you need to do.

- Oh, absolutely.

And, and where I came up with the line do it scared was true.

Cause I was looking for a title of my speech.

I was looking for a title of my book and it seemed almost cliche, you know, just do it.

Well, it wasn't that we can all just do it.

We can buy the shoes.

We can, you know, we can run in those shoes, but the it and the scared were important because then I determined as I got older and you have to determine what your it is.

If you're gonna do it scared you have to really focus on it.

And for me, I went the university of Colorado.

I was a top shot.

Well, what do you do with being a top shot in 1969 or 1965 going to college?

Well, your mother says you should major in education.

There were three options for women.

You became a teacher, a nurse or a secretary.

Those were the options now, very few but that's not totally true.

But there were women, some women who some ended up in the Supreme court who were attorneys, very few people because they weren't, they were scared to do that.

They wouldn't do the kinds of things that take grad school.

I was taught that my job was to get a degree in education find a husband, get an MRS degree.

Do you know what an MRS degree?

And this is when I talked to high school and college women.

Now they go, Mrs. - Is that a masters of related science?

What's that all about?

- And it is kind of, as you would say.

And I would that it, yes, it is a master's In way But I got elementary education degree, but didn't find the husband.

So I was kinda stuck.

I graduated in 1969.

Thank - You.

In 69, how do you go from, okay.

I have this degree in education to the secret service in 1970 - A woman made a call for me, a Dean of women.

And I look in that camera and I said, if I say if you or I or Leslie, or with the station here in fury can make a call for someone a one-on-one call.

It will change their life because you do need shoulders to stand on.

You do need women and supporters and people that have helped you along the way to make that call.

In this case, it was the Dean of women at the University of Colorado.

I went to see her and I said, Dean parish I loved my education degree.

I'd make a great teacher.

I will do that sometime.

But right now I wanna make a difference.

It was a contentious time.

John Kennedy had been assassinated in 1963 and then followed by Martin Luther king and followed by Bobby Kennedy.

We think now are scary times.

Those times were scary as well.

The streets were filled with protests.

The women's movement was in high motion and I didn't know what I wanted to do but I wanted to do something important, but keep in mind no opportunity in the military, no opera.

I would have loved to have gone to an academy.

Oh my God.

A great education learned to fly jets.

We had the air force academy just done.

They didn't even consider taking women.

The opportunities were so narrow.

She said, why don't you go to Washington?

In fact, I really wanted to go to wash. She picks up the phone, long curly cable you know, black hole, you know, with all the she calls the Congressman from our district Dawn.

She calls the cars, went dog, poly parish convocation.

I've got a young woman in my office.

Who's been active on campus.

I was president of Panasonic and always have been involved in nonprofit.

Anything I could do to help I've liked giving back.

She said, she's got some good leadership skills.

She's got a degree.

And I think she'd be a great staffer for you.

And the next words out of his mouth was can she type Hmm.

In those days, if you admitted, you could type.

And I think it was 90 words a minute.

You were stuck.

You would never get out from underneath the desk with our pretty pointed toed shoes.

You were stuck there.

Just like I was stuck with the boot saying I was scared to shoot the gun but I took the shot and I said, yes, I can type.

And I'm good.

But tell him, I can do other things.

- There is more to me there's more to me.

- But I got the job because I could type it.

Because then I talk about this.

I'm here in Peoria to, to help raise an endowment fund for the greater period boys and girls club.

Because and the message I tell young people is that it's all in your backpack.

Everybody has a backpack.

Now in those days we had big purses, but a big backpack full of unusual skills, things that other people don't do including typing for me, including being athletic including being one of the first scan instructors or not on the national ski patrol in my local ski area all these things I kept collecting in my backpack which gave me a more narrow focus of what I could do but yet a broader focus of the fact that there were a few people that had the skills that I do.

Certainly.

- So you and your backpack, head off to Washington where you're going to be a staffer.

How does staffer become secret service?

- Got to Washington, worked for him as a military caseworker.

I loved working on the hill, but I still there were protests in the streets.

There were things going on.

I still didn't feel part of the action.

Having lunch as girls do this friend of mine goes you won't believe this but they're hiring female bodyguards for to protect president Nixon's daughter.

Tricia said really?

And she said, yes but she said, I said, that sounds exciting.

And she said, yes, but you have to be able to shoot a gun.

I said, I couldn't do that.

And she's got no, no.

- These days the young girls would go shut up.

We didn't ever say words like - That, but you know, no, when I said, no, I really can.

She said, but I'd be scared to do that.

You might have to die.

And I said, gave that up a long time ago.

Where do I apply?

I applied interestingly the man who interviewed me was Clint hill the agent who jumped on the back of the limousine during the Kennedy assassination in Dallas and saved Mrs. Kennedy, the first lady and covered her body and the president's body with his own.

And I remember seeing that as a young woman as a sophomore in high school and thinking, who is he?

Why would he do that?

How did he jump from that car up, back behind the limits?

I mean, cause all we saw was the president and the first lady, governor of Texas driving down the street, we didn't know about all the agents in the security and all the things that they had going.

And here I was sitting with this man and he was telling me that they had decided to hire women in the 106 year old history of the secret service and outlined for me what what that entire intake entailed, which is a whole bigger story.

But I know we're going in a lot of directions but the end was you would need to be willing to give your life, to protect the president or a foreign head of state or whomever.

Would you have any trouble doing that?

And you know, I, I think you'd be the same way.

I think women inherently are caregivers.

We care if there's a toddler that wanders out toward a street or toward a subway, we're gonna get that baby.

It doesn't take a whole lot of training in your heart.

If oops, sorry about that.

I knew I could do that.

I wanted to do that.

I wanted a chance to serve and remarkably I was selected as one of five women that they hired in 1971, whenever the early - Ceiling breakers glass ceiling break.

Well we - Shot holes.

I would say cracked it now it's still not over.

- But yes, that's an interesting story of breaking through the male bastion of both local national and international law enforcement was the secret service.

It was the ultimate male shall we say macho the best of the best.

It was the boys club.

And there was a big sign across that said no girls allowed, oh my goodness.

You know what?

Yeah.

Okay.

- I thought it was literal for a second, but the protest from your band.

So it was a short tenure of three years for you in the secret three and a half.

I had some amazing experiences.

You ended up as part of the protective detail for JFK Jr. And Caroline Kennedy did - Probably they've fondly referred to me in the agency as the pistol pack and nanny, the men kind of laughed at it.

I thought it was fabulous for one two of the most revered youngsters in the world who had already been such through such a terrible tragedy of losing their father in the, in the, shall we say the companionship.

I was not friends with Mrs. Onassis or Mrs. Kennedy.

I was part of her security detail of her children.

I traveled with her when she was with her children to be in her presence.

And part of the sidebar.

Why I suppose, are you willing to die?

Well, yeah, I was dying for commitment to my country if I had to, but there was shall we say some perks, remarkable places.

My office was the white house.

When I traveled with the children I spent time at the Hyannis port the historic place that JFK was had a second home.

I spent two summers on the island of Scorpios protecting Caroline while she was with her, her mother on Aristotle yacht, Aristotle, Onassis yacht, the Christina.

Now I didn't live on the Christina.

I had a little room across the way across the water and the little town called I think it was a little Greek town and I stayed there and was basically on post waiting to see if she left the island.

And then I would be her bodyguard, her protector.

- So you repack your backpack just a few years later get married and move to Texas where you begin an 18 year career in broadcasting.

How did you make that switch?

- Well, I would say the switch came because and any woman will tell you that.

I think the rub comes with women agents is that they have children.

They have families, they are able to do it.

Now.

I think from what my research recently 50 years later is that the secret service being very accommodating when they can to provide, leave and furlough as far as kids are concerned and they, they don't it's not a negative.

Let me put it this way, but it puts a lot of stress in your backpack as to how to handle that life.

And I realized after several years I wanted to be the director and all the girls that are listening, going oh yeah, Clark wanted to be the director.

I wanted to do it.

Right?

I'm I'm, I'm not a perfectionist.

I never do anything for one reason.

I love the job.

I loved Washington.

I loved being part of history, but I realized that my love life was very lackluster.

I was actually on assignment with the queen of Spain which was a phenomenal assignment on the Apollo 14 blastoff there, I sat 24 years old, protecting a Royal.

And I often said to that being part of a foreign dignitary assignment like that had international implications too.

I mean, of course falling down on your watch of the president or their family, whatever it was the ultimate, but this would have international implications.

If you mishandled it professionally if you didn't say the right thing, you know, there was a lot of, a lot more, I would just say it was complicated.

Anyway, I'm sitting next to her.

To my left is the wife of Neil Armstrong.

The first man on the moon in front of me is Neil Armstrong.

He's talking to the king.

As we're watching this giant rocket taking off to take men to the moon and the king looked at Neil Armstrong out mind you, I didn't see the blastoff.

That's when your most observant football kickoffs activities comes go.

I mean, you're - Because eyes are on the app.

- I heard it.

And you could feel it.

I mean, it was, it was a historic dah, dah, dah, dah, dah dah, dah, dah, dah, dah, this huge rocket.

Not only I talk about breaking the glass ceiling that broke the glass sky when they were shooting those NASA rockets into them into space.

And the king turned to Neil Armstrong and said how did it feel to walk on the moon?

And astronauts Armstrong was so humble.

He said, I felt very small.

That's all I said.

Hmm, remarkable.

But to be in the presence of that kind of greatness was was part of the remarkable experience.

Plus we put them to bed that night and everybody was safe.

So that was all.

But the transition to marriage was my mother saw me sitting next to the queen on a Walter Cronkite.

Remember Walter Cronkite.

I actually got to interview him and he remembered this day and there were all the characters.

You know how they go in here?

We have the queen of Spain and the oh, the princess.

She became the queen and his Royal Highness and the director of NASA and the vice president Agnew and a woman.

He is going who's the woman - Talked to me in my airplane.

And he said in an under an unidentified woman we really don't know who she is.

At home my mother's going it's Catherine daddy, come in here Catherine sitting with all these important people.

And I know she's got a gun in her purse.

She will never find a husband.

So your mama queen of Spain in your mouth, that Mrs.

Degree.

Oh, in the Mrs degree.

And she calls me sister I've embroidered on this a little bit.

It's in my book, scared, fearless but that's the transition because she calls my sister.

Who'd done the perfect thing.

She'd married, a doctor she'd moved to Texas.

She had three kids, a carpool and two Yorkie dogs.

And she's my dearest friend and a wonderful wonderful woman volunteered the whole nine yards.

But she calls in and she said, you better find her a date.

She's never gonna get married.

Well, she did.

She found a charming psychiatrist from south Texas named Cecil Childers who wasn't afraid of me.

He was older than I was.

He was 15 years old.

And the fact that 15 years older, and the fact that I had all this stuff in my purse, he took me sailing.

Corpus Christi has a beautiful bay.

And he took me sailing on our first day at my purse rolled out because you carry it with you constantly.

You have to.

And all these things started rolling out on the on the floor of the boat or on the down under.

And he said, what's all that he said, your sister said you worked for the government, but what do you do?

And I said, well, maybe I should tell you a story.

But we dated for about a year in the midst of all of this.

And, and you know, they say, love it for side is a wonderful thing.

It's also usually inconvenient.

It doesn't come at the right time by any means.

It changes your life.

And it absolutely ruined my career because I couldn't have it all.

And in, I think by the S probably the eighties we thought we could have it all.

We thought if we had big shoulder pads and great big earrings, I still believe - In the big earrings.

You know - You could have it all your backpack.

Couldn't put everything in there.

And I do believe that you live life in chunks.

Sometimes you get the shot.

Sometimes you don't.

Sometimes you take a left turn sometimes do.

But in that case, he asked me to marry him while while I was training with an Uzi submachine gun on a, on a on a range in Washington, he had a very tenacious nurse.

I don't know if you remember this, but in the old days not so much now because they have cell phones, but it would be - Hi, Jared, get Kate on the phone.

You know - He was a very bright man and I don't think he knew how to make a phone call.

Doctors just, you know, and that was below - People for that stuff.

They have people - It's fine.

Me.

And so I'm on the range, 30 men and it's called and you know, we're putting in clips and and they're all my friends at this point.

And they liked me.

And all of a sudden, the guy up in the tower goes make your weapons safe, make your weapons safe.

Which means you put your elbows in the ground take out the clip, make your weapon safe.

Agent Clark has an emergency phone call from Texas.

Well, they're all looking at me like, oh God we know she dates someone in Texas.

I said, no, it's probably my mother and my mother, my sister, you know, something bad.

So I climbed to the top of the tower, pick up the phone and it's the nurse she's found me on the range.

It goes, Catherine it's Jerry, Dr. Childers would like to speak with him.

Then he gets on the line and he said, Kate, Kate, I've got the ring.

Will you marry me?

That was my proposal.

Wow.

And I said, Cecil, it's not a good time.

Did you say yes I did later.

But not at that point.

I had to finish shooting on the range.

- I hate to say this but we've just got just a few minutes left on this program.

I feel - Like I've gone to you forever.

So - You get married.

You moved to Texas 18 years in broadcasting.

You found it.

A breast cancer screening program.

First Friday, still in existence today you founded red cab productions, a publishing company chronicling beginning the chronicling of one of the largest snowfalls in Southern Texas.

Only - One in a hundred years.

I love firsts.

It's always better to be first than best.

I've had snow since then.

But I published a book about the first time it ever snowed on Christmas Eve in south Texas and sold 150,000 books.

Fantastic.

- And snow then went on to have more snow and more snow for kids, a few other iterations and you're ever do anything for just one reason.

- You know, the cutting room floor.

If you do an interview, do a clip.

If you do this, do what, you know cut it up, use it up, chop it.

Yeah.

- In your speeches to people all over the country, you ask others to identify and Own their own scared.

- I do.

And I'm gonna refer to my list here.

You know, I'm 73.

So you know, this was 50 years ago.

First thing is pack up your backpack and and look into your loan life and say what is it about me that no one would believe pay attention to the details of your life.

I've got a great story that I'll tell you.

If we have time about paying attention to the details they call the people that protect the president.

The detail, because it's a cadre of men and women who are a circle of protection.

The most important thing is the details.

And it's that long-term planning the short-term planning and then it's playing it by ear, reinvent yourself.

In my case, I moved to south Texas.

The only thing I was qualified to do was to be the sheriff.

I thought about running.

I genuinely did.

Instead.

I ran for city council because my husband didn't really want me running the jail.

You know, what's fun about that.

But anyway, I ran for city council and lost but the news director saw me doing interviews about running for city council and asked me, you'd love this event.

Would you be scared to talk to important people?

- And I said, have you read my resume?

Do I have to keep them align - With that?

So I ended up getting that job and I loved it.

I loved talk.

I'd much rather be on your side than this side, answering the questions.

Now I taught for the American Heart Association.

I talked to colleges, universities.

I just have come out with a book called "Scared fearless," which is my story.

And I talk about how important it is even doing it scared.

Then you have to define what you're scared you're it is because it changes all the time.

The changes when you have children it changes when you're married or you're not married.

It changes as you go along and is particularly important with your health and the American heart association messages that I think it's one out of.

I mean, America Heart Associatiom issue is such a big impacting on women where I thought it was mostly breast cancer.

And I did start a group in Corpus Christi where we raised enough money to give away 30,000 mammograms to women in need.

Outstanding, just because it was one thing we could do.

And we could know the people we were impacted at my age.

I'm reinventing because my husband died of Alzheimer's in three will be three years ago in July following hurricane Harvey that decimated our, our little Hamlet and, in south Texas.

I'm reinventing myself and deciding that I've got one more quarter to do something that's important.

And the one lesson I learned with being his protector being his caregiver was that it was much better in life to be kind rather than always, right.

I'm a fixer, you're a fixer strong women, strong men leaders are fixers.

We're leaving out the kind part.

And for Cecil, a bright, bright man who his favorite movie was three Amigos and would count trucks.

When I went down the highway and I would say, why You, you do the drive.

He looked at me Sadly with these piercing blue eyes.

And he said, because I can, it was much better for me to be kind about his disability then, right of saying, you have to watch this kind of programming.

You have to work with the computer.

You have to all this.

At that point in our relationship, it was just better.

And I, I send that message to people who are in caregiving roles and sometimes in parenting roles, I would say generally the fact that you define what your it is you do it scared you don't back off and leave your little boots on the line.

And as you get older, you really embrace the sense of humor and the kindness beautifully said - Kathryn Childers.

Thank you so much for being with us here.

- Thank You.

What a delight to meet you.

- I thank you for being with us here on Consider This as well.

It is always a privilege to be with you.

I'm Yvonne Greer.

Will see you next time.